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Monday, June 23, 2008
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TBO > News
Firefighters To Boycott Clearwater Over Wages, Other Woes
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By STEPHEN THOMPSON and ROD CHALLENGER
The Tampa Tribune News Channel 8
Published: June 23, 2008
CLEARWATER - In an action it has taken only twice before in the past 10 years, the Florida Professional Firefighters association is asking its 25,000 members not to have anything to do with a municipality whose firefighters, it says, are being treated poorly.
This time, the city is Clearwater.
This month at a convention in Tampa, 500 delegates from fire departments across the state voted unanimously to boycott the popular tourist destination, said Bob Carver, president of Florida Professional Firefighters.
In August, Carver added, at the International Association of Firefighters convention in Las Vegas, 3,000 representatives of fire departments across North America employing 300,000 firefighters also will be asked to boycott Clearwater, Carver said.
"Don't vacation, visit or be in Clearwater," Carver said. "It's only when a city has a callous disregard for the safety and health of its firefighters that we take this action."
The union representing Clearwater's firefighters has had a contentious relationship with Fire Chief Jamie Geer and City Manager Bill Horne.
For example, Clearwater Firefighters' Association Local 1158 didn't think two paramedics should have been fired in 2005 for opting not to respond to a call made by a mentally unstable woman known to make bogus 911 calls, when a police officer was helping her commit herself.
Now, the union says, the city is offering a zero percent wage increase for the firefighters' next contract and, as a result, the city and firefighters are at an impasse. In addition, the city is not allowing firefighters to hold the annual "Fill the Boot" drive to benefit the Muscular Dystrophy Association.
"Zero percent," said David Hogan, secretary and treasurer of the local. "That was the straw that broke the camel's back."
But that doesn't mean firefighters won't see an increase in their paychecks, said Doug Matthews, city spokesman.
Firefighters, for instance, will continue to get so-called step increases - a 5 percent step increase for each of the first five years of employment, followed by a 21/2 percent increase every other year up to 17 years.
Seventy-nine firefighters are slated to receive the 5 percent increase. Forty will get a 21/2 percent step increase, and 68 will receive no step increase this year, Matthews said. Typically, firefighters received a general wage increase on top of the step increase, he said.
The union also wants extra pay if firefighters are asked to do other people's jobs, even if the jobs pay less than what the firefighters earn regularly. They want overtime for meetings and training, even if they haven't worked their allotted hours by the time the meeting or training comes around, Matthews said. And they want two-hour lunch breaks.
As for the muscular dystrophy benefit, no solicitors are allowed to ask for money along city streets in accordance with a city ordinance designed to maintain public safety, Matthews said.
"There's no coincidence that this comes as we are right in the middle of impasse," Matthews said of the Florida Professional Firefighters' action. "This is a typical union tactic to personally attack the people that are in charge to try and get their way."
Five years ago, the firefighters association boycotted Jacksonville; 10 to 12 years ago, the organization voted to boycott Hollywood, Fla., Carver said.
Reporter Stephen Thompson can be reached at (727) 451-2336 or spthompson@tampatrib.com. Reporter Rod Challenger can be reached at (727) 536-8283 or rchallenger@wfla.com.
Reader Comments
Posted by ( JNXD ) on June 23, 2008 at 12:16 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
What a shame that something wonderful like the "Fill the Boot" campaign is subject to this bickering.
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Posted by ( RobKay ) on June 23, 2008 at 1:32 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
This really looks like both sides are over reacting to petty bickering. It was stupid for the town to ban the fill the boot campaign and it is stupid for the firefighters to expect even more raises than they are already receiving in the current economy. Both sides need to grow up and act responsibly.
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Posted by ( cyberpimp11 ) on June 23, 2008 at 6 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
RobKay you must not be employed in public safety. Firefighters and police officers are grossly underpaid to say the least. Those firefighters deserve to get paid a lot more then they are currently.
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Posted by ( Gladiator ) on June 23, 2008 at 6:38 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
maybe, but a two hour lunch? who desrves a two hour lunch? If there is nothing going on most sit and watch tv anyway. These guys have a dangerous job.However at the same time have it easy.Some are on ego trips and already make good money with benefits.
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Posted by ( skeeter ) on June 23, 2008 at 7:25 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
That's what happens when you let a big fat fake religion set up shop in your town, and not pay any taxes.
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Posted by ( hemi_girl ) on June 23, 2008 at 7:33 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
I don't think the "pass the boot" program is part of their job description but they get paid by the taxpayers to do it, please correct me if I'm wrong. And they want overtime pay for meetings and training even if they have not worked their normal alloted hours. I would like to have a job with that kind of incentive, please tell me where I can sign up. It sounds like a bunch of children having a temper tantrum to me. You chose your profession and in good times everyone makes extra money but in hard times EVERYONE has to bite the bullet somewhat.
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Posted by ( kimbo ) on June 23, 2008 at 7:35 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
"These guys have a dangerous job." So do clerks at the local 7-11.
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Posted by ( douston ) on June 23, 2008 at 8:15 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
A reality check...
a) A mandatory 5% increase for 5 years and then a mandatory 2.5% increase for the next 17 years??? Are you friggin' kidding me??? No jobs in the private sector get mandatory pay increases, they are based on merit. You need to EARN it guys!!! Oh, and just doing your job does not qualify as EARNING a pay increase.
b) Extra pay for doing other people's jobs? Not a chance...Welcome to the real world! This could be a good way to EARN a pay increase.
c) Overtime for meetings and training, even if they worked less than 40 hours??? Just part of the job...like the rest of the world.
d) Two-hour lunch breaks? You guys make me sick!
And don't give me the old & tired "we risk our lives crap". You knew the pay...you knew the benefits...you knew the risks...when you took the job.
It's not you were hired to answer the phone and then suddenly someone put an axe in your hand and made you run into a burning building.
If you don't like the pay or the hours then get another job...or a second job...just like the rest of us do.
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Posted by ( DRT33609 ) on June 23, 2008 at 9 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
I want a 2 hour lunch break
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Posted by ( gato_loco ) on June 23, 2008 at 9:07 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Considering the firefighters in Cleawater work 24 hours on duty, 24 hours off duty, 24 on, 24 off, 24 on, then have four days off. A 2 hour lunch that can be taken sometime during the shift really isn't asking a whole lot. Employers are required to provide a minimum break for most employees, a one hour lunch break during a typical 9-5 workday for most equates to 7 hours of production. Giving the firefighters a 2 hour break during their 24 hour shift would equate to 22 hours of production and 2 hours to rest, eat, shower, speak with family, workout, etc... I think its time for Clearwater to consider taxing the largest non tax paying base in the city in order to solve this financial issue
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Posted by ( DRT33609 ) on June 23, 2008 at 9:21 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Gee gato_loco. Guess I'm not as much of an expert on firefighter work schedules or the requirements of employers. Seems to me however, that a chunk of the time spent while on the shift is idle time. An acquaintance of mine that works in this profession told me this.
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Posted by ( joetampa ) on June 23, 2008 at 9:29 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
We pay these people to put out fires. Most of the time we see them congratulating themselves as heroes because they have the time to. Their benefits are already the best in the world!
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Posted by ( JonJacobs ) on June 23, 2008 at 9:50 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Newsflash for firefighters: The boycott will accomplish only one thing - make you look like fools. People aren't going to cancel their vacations, etc. because you don't get a long lunch break.
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Posted by ( firegrl ) on June 23, 2008 at 9:56 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Some of you guys (douston) really need to get your head out of our @sses, and educate yourself, or atleast try to, before you speak.
a)A mandatory 5% increase for the first five years and then a 2.5% increase EVERY OTHER YEAR, is by far very reasonable and well deserved. And it is NOT mandatory, it is part of our contract upon hire, so yes...that does make it binding. Most companies evaluate their employees and give ANNUAL raises, some up to a 3% cost of living expenses increase. So if you don't get this kind of reward at your job maybe you need to get your sorry behind a solid career and work for a reputable company that appreciates and rewards employees. Those of us that love what we do are just trying to support ourselves and families.
b)"Fill the Boot" is not in our job description, but it is expected to participate in community events and fundraisers. That benefits...guess who?...you guys...THE COMMUNITY
c) Two hour lunch breaks is VERY reasonable. There is no mandatory break time in the State of FL, but keep in mind there is a difference between a break and bona fide meal period (non compensaded). Although there is spare time at the firehouse, it is not OUR time. It is doing station duties, paperwork, training, working out and testing equipment. ALL part of the job description.
I know that some EMS personell are extremely arrogant, but we should not be unfair and acknowledge merit when merit is due. And yes my opinion may be bias, but real. DEAL WITH IT
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Posted by ( dlynn336 ) on June 23, 2008 at 10:07 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Please, everyone keep a few things in mind. First of all, what you see in the press sometimes is not completely accurate. God knows management would never try to sway public opinion their way by stating untruths. Second, the city of Clearwater has been actively working against there firefighters for more than two years now. Some might even say "UNION BUSTING'. Third, there are specific wage laws that apply to firefighters because of there extended hours they work per week. I would imagine as far as overtime for training, all they are asking is if they drive from home for a training session for a few or several hours, bypass the FLSA mark and be automatically paid overtime for those hours. Fourth, the annual boot collection is a tradition all over the country. It is done by on duty firefighters that are still responsible for answering calls. It involves no extra wages, so ultimately the only thing the City of Clearwater is hurting is handicapped children. I have been in the fire service for over twenty years now I am proud to say. Firefighters and paramedics are a value for the community. The training of firefighters and paramedics is extensive and intense. I admittedly do not know all the facts in this situation, but I don't think Clearwater firefighters are asking for anything outrageous, just a fair shake. I DONT EVEN THINK THEY ARE ASKING TO BE PAID LIKE THE INDIVIDUALS THEY RESPOND TO EACH DAY LIFE DEPENDS ON IT.
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Posted by ( RRR ) on June 23, 2008 at 10:07 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
I noticed the article did not show the current pay scale? why is that TBO? Shoddy reporting?I am sure that resigning the job is an option for anyone who does not like their current job. Get the point folks? I would like to see the analysis of what bill the taxpayers are going to be paying going forward in retirement and benefits. Is it really worth what they are getting from the firefighters right now?
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Posted by ( RRR ) on June 23, 2008 at 10:28 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
Someone says "Deal with it?" Nah that does not sound arrogant to me in these financial times. Wonder how that comment goes over in the private sector. I guess we could contract out the fire services. Oops did I say that out loud? Just "Deal with it."
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Posted by ( vinman566 ) on June 23, 2008 at 10:36 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
I hope that someday the city of clearwater government leaders as well as the administrators of the department one day value the efforts of the brave men and women whom they employ.
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Posted by ( douston ) on June 23, 2008 at 10:50 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
firegrl,
You are living in the past...cost of living increases in the private sector evaporated years ago. All pay increases are based upon merit...period.
Clearwater firefighters need to demonstrate why they are worth more money and better benefits. Just because the world has gotten more expensive doesn't automatically translate into "you get more money".
Read the rest of the comments on this article...most of them agree...and not with you.
Again...you knew what the job was...you knew the pay...you knew the lunch break...stop whining and deal with it.
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Posted by ( skeeter ) on June 23, 2008 at 11:38 a.m. ( Suggest removal )
They may be on duty for 24 hours straight, but they are not awake 24 hours. Doesn't that mean that for part of their workday, they are being paid to sleep?
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Posted by ( Reality ) on June 23, 2008 at 12:36 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
Most everyone would agree that firefighters have a dangerous job, earn every penny of their salary, and ought to be paid much, much more.
Most everyone would also agree that these are lean times and the taxpayers, many struggling to survive, are hard-pressed to understand why firefighters already getting a 5 percent step increase for each of the first five years of employment, followed by a 21/2 percent increase every other year up to 17 years, should be getting even more at this time.
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Posted by ( Romulan ) on June 23, 2008 at 12:38 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
Its very sad how so many uninformed people show no appreciation for what Firefighters do with your comments from this biased article.Is the City Manager or Fire Chief being asked to take a zero % pay increase? and 2 hour break in a 24 hour shift? that is asking too much? why dont you people that show so much hate for firefighters go to some of the scenes where they do everything they can to protect you comfortable lifestyle, your homes and your families? maybe then you will appreciate them more...How many Firefigthers lost or had severe damage to their homes during the recent hurricanes that have hit Florida while instead of tending to their homes they were out helping the same people that now are complaining about Firefighters having too many benefits.
No I am not a Clearwater Firefighter But I will be boycotting Clearwater till they finally start respecting the job they do.
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Posted by ( hemi_girl ) on June 23, 2008 at 1:19 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
A two hour lunch break in a 24 hour shift sounds reasonable IF THEY ARE WORKING THE ENTIRE TIME! But, if they are watching TV, playing video games, talking on the phone, and sleeping during the 24 hours like some have posted here, why do they need an extra 2 hours to eat??
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Posted by ( Romulan ) on June 23, 2008 at 1:53 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
So with that reasoning if i work an office job, and im not typing the whole time or doing my "duty" then I should cut my break? or if I work as sports star I should only get paid when I am playing the game right?Welcome to the real world...
If they had to work ALL the 24 hour shift then the city of Clearwater would be declared a disaster area.
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Posted by ( firegrl ) on June 23, 2008 at 2:12 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
(hemi_girl) I do see and understand your point of view, and I too would feel the same if I didn't know what ACTUALLY goes on. Not saying some municipalities don't have the luxury of relaxing during their shifts, but most of the stations stay very very busy helping folks out when trees jump in front of their vehicles or when negligent parents are too busy chatting away on their phones and lock infants in the cars. It is really hard to understand unless you have a true appreciation for the job, but everyone does have a right to their own opinion.
That's why I said "DEAL WITH IT". Not the situation but my opinion about it.
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Posted by ( epolice ) on June 23, 2008 at 3:03 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
Hey I actually LIKE the clearwater firemen.
LAY OFF>
I doubt THEY wanted this. Probably just one or two of them.
THat's where botto is.
He wants pam iorio ARRESTED. I'm sooo down with THAT.
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Posted by ( epolice ) on June 23, 2008 at 3:08 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
Geez. aren't you guys just a tad afraid that folks are going to catch on to the fact that you burn houses and businesses down to hold citizens hostage and make them feel threatened and that you have your dirty fingers in ALL THE PIES ??
Not only that, now you threaten to hold entire cities hostage.
People ARE catching on.
THey are arrogant. IT comes with the murdering territory firegrl. If they'll MURDER they think that makes them MANLY.
IT's also why so many of htem drive those big four by fours.
You know .... that old joke?
It's true.
THey really ARE compensating.
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Posted by ( epolice ) on June 23, 2008 at 3:25 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
I'm just thinking that IF I have ANY money to spend since I loathe spending it in tampa I'm going to lavish all of it all over clearwater. luckily i have some pennies to play with.
scooch over, firemen. I'm coming to play.
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Posted by ( epolice ) on June 23, 2008 at 3:42 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
This is making me seriously consider moving to clearwater.
does this mean the scientologists OPPOSE the firemen?
Wow so many questions ....
raise yer flags, folks.
The feudal times are upon us.
again./
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Posted by ( CaptainRuss ) on June 23, 2008 at 3:53 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
epolice, errr I mean vox- you are so incredibly transparent. go spew your conspiracy theories elsewhere!
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Posted by ( Bonsai ) on June 23, 2008 at 4:31 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
Gee douston - I hope your house doesn't catch fire.
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Posted by ( Bonsai ) on June 23, 2008 at 4:37 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
So douston - just because most of these comments agree with one another that makes them (and you) right? I don't think so.
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Posted by ( Bonsai ) on June 23, 2008 at 4:39 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
Skeeter says - They may be on duty for 24 hours straight, but they are not awake 24 hours. Doesn't that mean that for part of their workday, they are being paid to sleep?
Duh!
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Posted by ( Bonsai ) on June 23, 2008 at 4:43 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
How many of you brainiacs put your life on the line when you go to work? Breaking a fingernail on the computer keyboard doesn't compare. You all need a lot of education and all need to grow up.
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Posted by ( Romulan ) on June 23, 2008 at 5:09 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
Sadly some of these posters are either fat uninformed web warriors or just 12 year old kids with nothing to do.
Find me any other job where a person will run in harms way to save another person that they dont even know.There are a few people that dont get enough money and deserve more: Military, Police, Firefighters, Doctors are DEFINATELY up there.
Ohh and for those that think its such a "easy job" Go to Fire Academy, then become a paramedic and when your holding a child in your arms trying to bring it to life lets see how easy it is...Do most even know that Firefighters are EMTS and PARAMEDICS? meaning they respond to Everything not just fires...
Ohh well, Clearwater should be ashamed and Good luck Firefighters from Clearwater!
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Posted by ( Truth_Reality ) on June 23, 2008 at 5:39 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
Unlike some of the uneducated, jealous and obvious misguided posts by insipid twits, I believe I can speak of the issue with a solid frame of reference having worked in the private sector for over a decade and also as a professional firefighter for almost twenty years. Clearwater's elected officials and it's City Manager Bill Horne have carried out their apparent illegal and unlawful fight only because they have taxpayer dollars to do so and a burning vengeance that enables them from suppressing these prohibited activities. In the private sector this would have never happened. City Mgr. Horne's LOSS of EVERY lawsuit is compelling on it's face. The Citizens of Clearwater should be appalled & outraged at the waste of their tax dollars. How much so far? Almost $1 Million and counting? The conspicuous inactions of Mayor Hibbard & the Commission to allow these horrifying events to continue, is an apparent certain endorsement and condones these illicit behaviors. The Firefighters have only reacted(and won in COURT)to the injustices that have been committed against them. Wouldn't you? Or have most Americans been programmed not to fight against injurious wrongdoings committed against them? Become part of the solution by educating yourself COMPLETELY in order to have a logical, serious opinion based in FACT! To get the facts, visit the web site, www.saveclearwaterfire.org, and get informed.
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Posted by ( Truth_Reality ) on June 23, 2008 at 7:17 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
This so called “News Story” by the alleged “reporters”,Stephen Thompson & Rod Challenger is so sorely lacking even an iota of understanding,concise information and clear facts, that I must assume that the Editors had the day off . The clear bias & damage of such “news” will only serve to confuse most people on such complex issues. Doug Matthews, Clearwater’s propaganda agent, masquerading as an informative “spokesman”, did a splendid job of muddling the issue and confusing most outsiders that have no knowledge of the depth of these matters. Those in search of knowledge go to, www.saveclearwaterfire.org, & get informed, further:
1st: Clearwater firefighters work a 53 hour work week. Without overtime.
2nd: Even the “step” raises are based on a satisfactory evaluation, hence MERIT, the story even states that almost 70 firefighters will get absolutely NO increase this year. That’s 40% of front line personnel. Add that to three prior years, (1995/2002/2003), when No cost of living increase was seen either! And next year? The City has budgeted ,get this, -3% for firefighter pay! Look up Clearwater’s proposed budget, it’s all true.
3rd: The “meetings & training” that are spoke of, are above and beyond Firefighter’s scheduled 53 hour week. It is NOT as Mr. Matthews spoke of.
4th: As far as “personal attacks” averred by the Dis-informationist Matthews, ask him about the Assistant City Manager Gary Brumback who threatened Firefighters in writing with, “Your going Down, Vengeance”. Or Assistant Chief Riley’s porn laden computer, that the City tried unsuccessfully to pass the blame to the firefighters.To the people that know the true value and precious resource that professional Firefighters are, Thank you!To the uneducated, impish and vile hate mongers- Get Help, you truly are the bane of the human race.
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